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World Cup of Pool |
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spoony
Quite a regular
Joined: 30-Mar-2006
Posts: 55
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Posted: 2006-05-29 19:57
like i said earlier just hold a qualifying tournament and then no one can complain who gets in the team
also was this event in everyones mind 6 months ago when they were playin (i bet not). so why revert to the rankings, matchroom probably only confirmed the event in the last few weeks or so
surely daz appleton has a shout for one of the english teams
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Benjamin
Home away from home
Joined: 29-Mar-2006
Posts: 364
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Posted: 2006-05-29 23:32
I would put a fair wad on O'Sullivan & Hundal (Ronnie and Rajy as a good friend of mine came up with) being one pairing.
I agree with spoony that Darren Appleton would usually come into contention.
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dazzler
Home away from home
Joined: 14-Mar-2006
Posts: 1289
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Posted: 2006-05-30 08:20
The EPT will be using 100% rankings to determine placings for its big final event...more info coming on the big final event in the next couple of days.
Dont miss out!!!
D4RYL.
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BigDave
Moderators
Joined: 13-Mar-2006
Posts: 11008
From: England
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Posted: 2006-05-30 09:03
Welcome back Dazzler!
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dazzler
Home away from home
Joined: 14-Mar-2006
Posts: 1289
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Posted: 2006-05-30 09:22
Thanks mate, good to be back...with a semi tan lol
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thecardman
Home away from home
Joined: 13-Mar-2006
Posts: 359
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Posted: 2006-05-30 10:43
Just back on the Scottish bit, I think Pat and Michael have been picked for a number of reasons (well, that I can think of). First off, between them, they have won every Ranking Event we have had so far this year. Sure, Clark reached final in Inverness and took the Yeti all the way (with a great performance), but that one fact on current form cannot be denied. Secondly, and this in my opinion is more important, both Pat and Michael have played on the TV tables of major events (both 8 Ball and 9 Ball) in the past and are used to the bright lights and unique pressure that is created by having the bright lights and cameras there. As good as Clark, Davy and Jayson all are (their rankings and titles speak volumes), there is nothing that beats experience (of course, there is the old argument of how do you get experience without the chance?). To the gang at Pro9, thanks for allowing us to semi-take over this thread while the SAPPA Site is down. It is due to us being over our Bandwidth allocation! Didn't know we were that popular! Things should be back to 'normal' around Thursday. Anyway, thanks once again. Best wishes thecardman  - just heard about The Miz The Cardman's Blog
www.scottish9ball.com
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read_this
Just can't stay away
Joined: 16-May-2006
Posts: 109
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Posted: 2006-05-30 12:09
As ever with matters such as this it is the lack of transparency with which such decisions are made that causes consternation amongst players. If we all knew where the goalposts were we could at least try to make our way towards them in the first place!
Let's face it, the average player (i.e. not Ronnie O, Steve Davis, Efren etc.) is not going to be able to individually sway the selection policies of organisations such as Matchroom Sport or the IPT, whose primary concerns are commercial and therefore financial (can we sell our product). Though it may be a disappointment to players who dedicate themselves to do as best they can through the available means, such as national tours and related ranking lists, I'm not sure there is much that can be done about tournaments that lie outside the auspices of organisations such as the BPPPA or SAPPA.
I would however say that one principle that should be upheld is that any spots for tournaments that are awarded via the afforementioned organisations should always be decided on the basis of current rankings. Personally I am never in favour of wildcards given by the associations and would need to be convinced of the reasoning behind qualifying tournaments too. The organisers of such tours should also press as much as they can for commercial tournament organisers to take rankings into account within their selection policies. Surely we should expect no less if we patronise their events?
Regards,
RT
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dazzler
Home away from home
Joined: 14-Mar-2006
Posts: 1289
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Posted: 2006-05-30 12:27
All places gained for "extra events" will be decided from the rankings on the EPT  Just thought i'd mention that. D4RYL.
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BigDave
Moderators
Joined: 13-Mar-2006
Posts: 11008
From: England
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Posted: 2006-05-30 12:30
^^^ Best first post EVER!!! ...From RT.
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read_this
Just can't stay away
Joined: 16-May-2006
Posts: 109
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Posted: 2006-05-30 14:07
On 2006-05-30 12:27 , dazzler Wrote:!!! QUOTE !!! All places gained for "extra events" will be decided from the rankings on the EPT
Just thought i'd mention that.
D4RYL. I like that commitment Daryl and would like to see it made explictly in other quarters. After all, the word association implies an organised group of like minded individuals with a similar interest, and associations are typically charged with lobbying on behalf of their members. Associations also tend to canvass the opinion of their membership on important policy matters that impact upon them directly. This serves two very good purposes. Firstly, it reassures the associates that the association is listening to their points of view, whilst acknowledging that you can't please all of the people all of the time, and, secondly, it gives the association a mandate to speak on behalf of its members. I am also pleased to see that you intend to incorporate some mechanisms for doing this within the EPT and feel that again others might consider following suit. I'm curious about the name choice for the EPT though. You weren't feeling a tad colonial were you ?  Regards, RT
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dazzler
Home away from home
Joined: 14-Mar-2006
Posts: 1289
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Posted: 2006-05-30 14:25
Colonial me? nahh.
I have to say that i agree 100% with what you have to say on this matter....The rankings are thier for a reason so why arent they being used enough?
D4RYL.
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Destroyer
Home away from home
Joined: 14-Mar-2006
Posts: 530
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Posted: 2006-05-30 15:13
On 2006-05-28 18:59 , Phil_Mitchell Wrote:!!! QUOTE !!! Clark...you have my sympathy. I was present at a "committee discussion" Ross held to see who should be put forward for the team. Most present chose Michael/Pat, whilst Ross seemed to be in favour of Michael/Jayson. I was the only one who put Davy's name forward (as the official number 2 to Michael) for exactly the reasons you just stated. Ranking lists have to be there for a reason.
In the end, I think it was "agreed" to hold a scotch doubles qualifying event, with the winning pair representing Scotland. And that was the last I heard of it. Seems Ross has had a change of heart all on his own. What's the point of having a committee....(insert your own gripe here).......etc.
There's no doubt Michael and Pat will be a formidable duo, and will represent Scotland well. I'll certainly be cheering them on. But the way things are decided up here is shocking.
To the regular Pro9 members...sorry to get all "Scottish" on your asses, but our forums out of order till Thursday, so we have to air our grievances here. As for the English team? No doubts it should be Raj and Dazzler, in an echo of my above argument. Well this is all news to me! So the Scottish team has been selected. Would have been nice to be told officially. Typical! Ah well, good luck to Michael and Pat, hope they do us proud. p.s. Phil Mitchell, put on your dancing shoes..........
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malaguista
Home away from home
Joined: 14-Mar-2006
Posts: 1176
From: Spain
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Posted: 2006-05-30 15:35
An educated poster at last, how refreshing, makes a change from the likes of Simsman!!!!!!!!!
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BigDave
Moderators
Joined: 13-Mar-2006
Posts: 11008
From: England
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Posted: 2006-05-30 16:47
Actually I don't think we've had a duff post in months - I believe even Mr Sims has turned a new leaf too!
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9m
Home away from home
Joined: 26-Apr-2006
Posts: 268
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Posted: 2006-05-30 17:33
o sullivan and dazzler! or davis!
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Cueist
Just popping in
Joined: 26-May-2006
Posts: 6
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Posted: 2006-05-30 17:58
I understand what the cardman is saying to a certain extent, but there has only been 3 ranking events this year so far, so if you want to pick the team based on that, why not have a 3 tournament ranking list??? On cardmans second point, i cant speak for Davy or Jayson but i did play pro snooker for 3 years and have played under the tv lights down in prestatyn, and as i think Dazzler will tell you from his days at Blackpool, there is a fair bit of pressure down there! I think the general concensus has been that it should go with rankings but i doubt it will change anything! I would have been happy with just a shot at a play-off, because im honest enough to admit that there is not a totally obvious choice to partner Michael given the facts. Or if someone was gonna get picked ahead of me, i would have apprieciated a better reason than "Pat is a more well known player because he travels more"  . Lastly, thanks guys for all your opinions on this, although i know most of you probably dont care whos in the Scottish team  . p.s. None of what ive written on this thread is against Pat Holtz personally, who i like and have alot of respect for as a player, it is just against the system in general.
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Cueist
Just popping in
Joined: 26-May-2006
Posts: 6
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Posted: 2006-05-30 18:15
Oh, and i hope Michael and Pat bring the trophy home. Beating England in the final would be nice! (before everyone gets annoyed, i could have said i wanted yous to lose 1st round!)
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BigDave
Moderators
Joined: 13-Mar-2006
Posts: 11008
From: England
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Posted: 2006-05-30 18:40
An all UK final would be OK with us too pal! See you there mate!
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malaguista
Home away from home
Joined: 14-Mar-2006
Posts: 1176
From: Spain
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Posted: 2006-05-31 07:14
Be realistic Dave and not patriotic, it aint gonna happen!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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read_this
Just can't stay away
Joined: 16-May-2006
Posts: 109
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Posted: 2006-05-31 10:46
On 2006-05-30 17:58 , Cueist Wrote:!!! QUOTE !!! I understand what the cardman is saying to a certain extent, but there has only been 3 ranking events this year so far, so if you want to pick the team based on that, why not have a 3 tournament ranking list???
On cardmans second point, i cant speak for Davy or Jayson but i did play pro snooker for 3 years and have played under the tv lights down in prestatyn, and as i think Dazzler will tell you from his days at Blackpool, there is a fair bit of pressure down there!
I think the general concensus has been that it should go with rankings but i doubt it will change anything! I would have been happy with just a shot at a play-off, because im honest enough to admit that there is not a totally obvious choice to partner Michael given the facts. Or if someone was gonna get picked ahead of me, i would have apprieciated a better reason than "Pat is a more well known player because he travels more" .
Lastly, thanks guys for all your opinions on this, although i know most of you probably dont care whos in the Scottish team .
p.s. None of what ive written on this thread is against Pat Holtz personally, who i like and have alot of respect for as a player, it is just against the system in general. Of course players south of the border care about such decisions, if only for the fact that they provide further exemplars of the ad hoc decision making that the majority of us do not wish to see. If this decision was made by 'committee' as an earlier post in this thread suggests (and I'm not familiar with the SAPPA structures so can't comment on that), and not by Matchroom, then surely there are grounds to ask for justification of such decisions to the membership of SAPPA. At some level there has to be some form of accountability, and accountability requires transparency in decision making. If our pool organisations want to be respected by their membership then the proceedings and minutes of official meetings should always be available to association / tour members, and surely a decision such as this, if actually in the hands of SAPPA, should have been made at an official meeting. As I think I said above as players we should expect our associations to have explicit policy on these matters. We then know where we stand and can either strive to meet whatever criteria are relevant, strive to change the criteria, or vote with our feet. This is so often discussed, but so rarely resolved. Regards, RT
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