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Topic: colchester


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Author colchester

nipper
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Joined: 17-Mar-2006
Posts: 329
From: harrow middlesex


ireland    avatar

posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 00:08

guys im not trying to stir it honest,i recently bought a copy of billiards the official rules and records book, published by billiard congress of america, and it states underplayer may bring a maximum of 3 cue sticks to a match
width of tip ..........no minimium/14maximum ect ect,, which rules are you playing to.



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nipper
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From: harrow middlesex


ireland    avatar

posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 00:11

i will clarify later, had a few beers tonight



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BigDave
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europe    avatar

posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 01:39

You are correct, and I quote from Pro9's copy of the relevant Billiard Congress of America'a rules section concerning equipment: http://www.pro9.co.uk/html/RulesEquipment.php

---QUOTE------------------------------------------------------
POOL CUE SPECIFICATIONS:

Player may bring a maximum of 3 cue sticks to a match.

Width of tip: 9 mm minimum / 14 mm maximum
Weight: no minimum / 25 oz. maximum
Length: 40 inches minimum / no maximum
The cue tip may not be of a material that can scratch or damage the addressed ball. The cue tip on any stick must be composed of a piece of specially processed leather or other fibrous or pliable material that extends the natural line of the shaft end of the cue and contacts the cue ball when the shot is executed.

Ferrule, if of a metal material, may not be more than 1 inch in length.

The cue tip on any stick used to perform a legal jump shot must be composed of either a leather or synthetic leather material.
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Cues are counted as butts according to Michaela Tabb, shafts are not counted, so a "break/jump cue" would count as one cue, does that make a difference?

I always thought it would be a good idea to have a dedicated three-quarter-length "masse" cue like some of the trick-shot players have, but realised it would have to be a combined jump/masse cue to stay within the rules!



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Riggers
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posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 07:57

The world standardized rules available on the BPPPA web site (including the section with updates effective January 2006) make no mention of this. So why are Pro9 and the BPPPA quoting different rules?

Thought I'd seen the last of multiple sets of rules being used all over the place when I stopped pleying that Reds & Yellows **** :-(



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President
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Joined: 13-Mar-2006
Posts: 13
From: Manchester, UK


blank    avatar

posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 08:53

I thought it was time the old man cleared this one up for you!

Before I do though just let me say it was nice to hear everyone enjoyed the Tournament at Colchester and I think Big Dave has done a terrific job here on Pro9.

I was asked this question by a chap in Colchester so I can only presume it was you Nipper. Anyway here's the official answer:

A lot of people get really confused between "rules" and 'regulations" - I have called them regulations as I cannot find another more suitable word at this time in the morning! At times I can see how it can be a grey area.

Rules: These are the official set of World Standardised Rules written and published by the WPA - we should all know these just like we learned to read the alphabet. here's an example from the section Rules of Tournament Play 1.1: It is the player's responsibility to be aware of all rules, regulations and schedules applying to competition. While tournament officials will make every reasonable effort to have such information readily available to all players as appropriate, the ultimate responsibility rests with the player. etc, etc.

Regulations: These are the unpublished Rules which apply to all Tournaments and are at the sole discretion of the Tournament Director and/or organisation and occasionally they can overide the WPA World Standardised Rules. Examples: Dress code, cue ball fouls only, winner breaks, alternate break, no smoking etc etc

The number of cues a player may bring into the arena most definately comes into the second category which I have called "regulations" However, Nippers point is quite valid and this topic does appear in his rule book which has been published by the BCA. Years ago, the WPA in its infancy commissioned the BCA to write a book of rules and they were adopted by the WPA for world matchplay.

Riggers is correct that the topic is not covered in the rules on the BPPPA website - sorry Dave - I will send you a revised version as they were amended 1st January 2006.

Most of you will know (and sometimes to your horror!) that I eat the rules for breakfast and read them again before I go to bed every night so I hope you have enjoyed this little 2 cents worth from me.

Ted Bristow
WPA/EPBF/BPPPA Rules Instructor for GBR



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Riggers
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posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 09:20

Aha... So it's not the 'rules' I need to worry about when I play in a new tournament, it's the 'regulations' :-) Thanks for clearing that up Ted.

So, if a players brings 4 cues into the arena (even though he only uses 3) what would the penalty be and in the absence of a referee does the penalty only apply if the opponent brings the misdemeaner to the attention of the Tournament Director?



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President
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From: Manchester, UK


blank    avatar

posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 09:30

You're very welcome Lee.

Most tournaments the TD will allow as many cues as you wish but it is your responsibility to check before playing. A penalty for an offence like this could be loss of game or even a scratch from the tournament.

You raise a great point in your post which will probably surprise a lot of people. If a tournament has no referees but has a certified TD then ALL matches are deemed to be refereed! I'm sure we will see a few more posts about that one!

Ted Bristow
WPA/EPBF/BPPPA Rules Instructor for GBR


-----------------
Ted Bristow
President
B.P.P.P.A.
British Professional Pool Players Association
ted.bristow@bpppa.org



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Riggers
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posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 10:48

Ok, so to be specific about this case the number of cues allowed is a regulation not a rule so it would be specified by the Tournament Director. In this case it wasn't specified as there was no mention of it on the BPPPA site or on any notice at the tournament and the 'referee' - this clever bloke who managed to single handedly referee all matches :-) did not call anything so Daryl has no case to answer right?

I mean it's a reasonable defence for a player to say he has checked all the rules and regulations published by the tournament organisers and all the notices at the event, so therefore he has fulfilled his obligation under rule 1.1 to 'be aware of all rules, regulations and schedules applying to competition'.



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dazzler
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posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 13:28

Yeah i agree Lee!! lol

By the way, i only used 3 cues... Playing cue, Jump break cue (thats 2 in total) and the third was a different break cue with a leather tip (which i use for breaking from the box on IPT)
The reason i did this was because niether of us in the final could hardly make a ball from the break, so thought i should try something different...and it worked..lol


D4RYL.



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expertfluke
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posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 15:43

Dazzler, sorry to be simple but what's breaking from the box? When you say you tried something different, do you mean a soft break?

Your wise words could help me shoot up the rankings!!:-D



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Riggers
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posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 15:55

Breaking from the box means between the middle 2 diamonds on the foot rail rather than over by the side rail where most 9-ball players break from. On the IPT 8-ball tour breaking from the box is compulsory.



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dazzler
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posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 17:06

yeah well explained Riggers, i just use a different cue for breaking from the box...the cue i use is much thinner on the shaft so its much more comfortable with the loop bridge etc.....i also think that i can break much, much harder from the box by the way.
But that isnt always a good thing i guess!!

D4RYL.



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nipper
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From: harrow middlesex


ireland    avatar

posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 20:00

daryl you also used a jump cue with a fancy end to it when the match was about 8-6 to play the 1 ball in the kitchen right hand pocket, you missed the pot and i also pointed out that it was the fourth cue to the other 4 players who had discussed the rule with me prior to this ,if as ted states that this is a regulation and he can change it to whatever he wants can he also change the regulations on cue lenght and weight as he likes



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President
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Posts: 13
From: Manchester, UK


blank    avatar

posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 20:15

Nipper,

All BPPPA Tournaments conform to the WPA World Standardised Rules. The weight and lengths of cues are detailed within the "Rules" so therefore as T.D. I would not change that. However the number of cues a player brings to the arena is of no consequence providing he uses ONLY those cues during his/her match. He therefore cannot borrow one during the game. The rules relating to cue sticks are as follows:

Length of Cue: 40 inches minimum / No Maximum
Weight of Cue: No minimum / 25 oz. maximum
Width of Tip: No minimum / 14mm maximum

The cue tip may not be of a material that can scratch or damage the addressed ball. The cue tip on any stick must be composed of a piece of specially processed leather or other fibrous or pliable material that extends the natural line of the shaft end of the cue and contacts the cue ball when the shot is executed..

The ferrule of the cue stick, if of a metal material, may not be more than 1 inch in length.

Ted Bristow
WPA/EPBF/BPPPA Rules Instructor for GBR

p.s. Only best intentions meant Riggers but I do believe you meant to say "head rail"


-----------------
Ted Bristow
President
B.P.P.P.A.
British Professional Pool Players Association
ted.bristow@bpppa.org
[ This message was edited by: President on 2006-05-16 20:19 ]



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nipper
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From: harrow middlesex


ireland    avatar

posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 21:26

sorry ted can you please tell me the rule # that deals with cue spec's



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dazzler
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somalia    avatar

posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 22:33

nipper you didnt see me play a jump shot with a jump cue with a fancy end on it coz i dont have one...i only have a jump break cue...thats all.


D4RYL.



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nipper
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Joined: 17-Mar-2006
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From: harrow middlesex


ireland    avatar

posticon   Posted: 2006-05-16 23:03

well did you not take a jump cue from your bag and use it about that time or have i got it all wrong



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Benjamin
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posticon   Posted: 2006-05-17 00:33

After swapping break cues, Daryl replaced his original break/jump cue in his case. When the jump shot arose, he took out his original break/jump cue, played the shot and returned to his seat, leaving the cue out for possible further use with only the half butt on. Sorry nipper but you are mistaken dude.



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Riggers
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uk    avatar

posticon   Posted: 2006-05-17 08:07

On 2006-05-16 20:15 , President Wrote:

!!! QUOTE !!!


p.s. Only best intentions meant Riggers but I do believe you meant to say "head rail"


Yes, thanks Ted.

expertfluke - Whatever you do, when breaking from the box don't try it from the foot rail. It could be a foul :-D




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dazzler
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somalia    avatar

posticon   Posted: 2006-05-17 09:59

Benjamin has got it bang on...sorry nipper, but that is what happened.


D4RYL.



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